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PostPosted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 8:21 am 
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robod wrote:
- I've tested 2 different USB disks&enclosures to make sure it's not faulty. They both work fine on my other machines
- When I boot into 2.4.17 kernel, everything is rock solid (albeit a bit slowish at 5MB/s)
- When I boot into 2.6.22 and THEN attach the USB drive, things are working fine mostly, even though it crashed on me once
- When I boot into 2.6.22 with the USB drive attached, it goes down the hill.

...

The LS1 simply stops responding until the watchdog performs a reset. There is absolutely nothing in any of the logs. It simply stops logging anything (like if all disk I/O stopped) and then the next entry is the boot.


Hi,
the same behaviour I see an Terastation PPC. USB is stable on 2.4.20 and crashes on all version 2.6.21 and above up to 2.6.23. I could boot the station from a USB stick but reading a large file crashes the box. Writing seems ok. For me a
Code:
dpkg -l
crashes/freezes the box in two out of three times while reading the 20MB large file /var/lib/dpkg/available. Sometimes I only get a parsing error of this file. The file itself is ok. Running the command twice crashes the box always. I bought three different 2 GB memory sticks for that purpose and with all of them I have the same problem.

I would make some additional tests to find out the root cause and want to ask here if somebody made some analyzes before:
* Is there a USB patch in the 2.6 kernels from Sylver and andre?
* Did somebody analyze the 2.4 sources from Buffalo if there are modifications to the USB drivers? I had a short look but it seems that they use the USB sources from another kernel revision in a subdirectory drivers/new_usb. So it is not so easy to see what they eventually have changed.
* In Buffalos 2.4.20 kernel there is a file arch/ppc/8xx_io/usb.c. Is this related to the USB subsystem on my Terastation which has an external NEC USB chip onboard?

The things which I would suggest to anaylze:
* Boot with large enough swapping file on a IDE device. I currently have no swapping at all.
* Boot with extended USB logging enabled and log files on a IDE device.
Maybe robod, you, made some of these tests before?

Is there anybody out there who was able to rebuild Buffalos 2.4.20 kernel? Which (cross) toolchain to use?


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2007 11:49 pm 
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Hi igs,

I used kernel with USB_DEBUG enabled (see about 3-4 posts back) which andre kindly compiled for me. It didn't say anything at all when it died. If it's still on his web, you can try it to see whether you will see any difference at all.

I was planning to go through sylver's patched 2.6 kernel as well to see what portions of usb (if any) have been patched. It's available on svn. See sylver's post about 2.6 kernel earlier. I am not sure whether Andre adds any more patches before he compiles the kernel. I haven't dared to ask Sylver for a list of patches, yet, although it would probably be the most effective way of finding out :).

There're some wikis on the main site explaining how to recompile 2.4 kernel and even some about the cross toolchain. I'm connected via GPRS from the hotel, so I can't give you the exact links as any browsing is painfuly slow...

My goal is to analyze whether any of the applied patches might have caused this problem. If it's not likely that try to submit bug to usb-devel list and try to make somebody to have a look...


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 7:10 am 
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kernel_universal contains everything you need. In combination with my .config and the hints in my (outdated) compilation docs about what Debian packages to install, you should be able to 'just compile' the kernel with "make uImage".

While youre at it, you might look for the cause of the RTC problems...


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 4:27 pm 
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robod wrote:
I used kernel with USB_DEBUG enabled (see about 3-4 posts back) which andre kindly compiled for me. It didn't say anything at all when it died. If it's still on his web, you can try it to see whether you will see any difference at all.


I tried that USB_DEBUG before and had the same behaviour - no info before the freeze. I think about installing syslog-ng and logging over the net in the hope that this subsystem maybe lives a little bit longer. But there's not much hope.

robod wrote:
I was planning to go through sylver's patched 2.6 kernel as well to see what portions of usb (if any) have been patched. It's available on svn. See sylver's post about 2.6 kernel earlier. I am not sure whether Andre adds any more patches before he compiles the kernel. I haven't dared to ask Sylver for a list of patches, yet, although it would probably be the most effective way of finding out :).


I was looking through the Buffalo sources. It is a 2.4.20 kernel. There is a directory called drivers/usb_new which seems to be a development version nearly identical to drivers/usb from 2.4.26. There are some changes from MontaVista which I think do not apply to my box. I believe that the problems don't come from the USB subsystem.

So I believe the problem is in another part of the kernel. DMA, MM, PCI, interrupt handling or something related.

robod wrote:
There're some wikis on the main site explaining how to recompile 2.4 kernel and even some about the cross toolchain. I'm connected via GPRS from the hotel, so I can't give you the exact links as any browsing is painfuly slow...

Thanks.

robod wrote:
My goal is to analyze whether any of the applied patches might have caused this problem. If it's not likely that try to submit bug to usb-devel list and try to make somebody to have a look...


Sounds good. I have now collected more than 10 kernel version here. I could diff the Buffalo sources against Vanilla and Sylvers sources against Vanilla. One version of the sources from andre is available too. So far I can see Sylver has ported most of the arch/ppc stuff to 2.6. He has restructured it, removed unneeded sandpoint code and made all variants selectable in the .config file. Really good work! I don't know if Sylver has somewhere documented what he has done so far and what is open. And maybe he has a better feeling where the 2.4 arch/ppc code maybe won't work as expected on 2.6??

Robod, if you need any of the source code let me know. I'll give you all you need. And maybe we should exchange all of the analyzing results to avoid doing things twice.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 12:57 am 
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Hi there,

Andre, I've just tried your latest v87 kernel, with the same result :cry:.
Have you got any early & relatively stable 2.6.XX kernel somewhere? I need it to be stable enough to reboot, and do my USB killer test...

I went quickly through Sylver's kernel in SVN and couldn't see any patches in the USB section that may have had impact on stability of the kernel. I am not sure whether Andre/Sylver apply any more patches (apart from those two mentioned in http://hvkls.dyndns.org/downloads/docum ... lation.txt) before compiling the kernel or not.
If not, I can see two possibilities:
- There is a bug in the generic kernel 2.6.*. This may be specific to PPC or to the NEC USB controller that's being used in LS
- Buffalo have applied some specific patches to 2.4.* that need to be ported to 2.6.* as they may be tailored to the LS hardware. IGS had a look at 2.4.20 and couldn't find anything, however my LS1 is using 2.4.17...

Anybody else any ideas/thougts?

Cheers


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 9:40 am 
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Check out the kernels in my archive directory, preferably the legacy kernels mentioned in README-kernel-variants.

To repeat my answer to your repeated question, kernel_universal is the kernel deployed, unless otherwise mentioned. FYI, the AVR problems have been addressed successfully in the meantime, v87 will be the next variant-legacy.

Have you ever tried a different distribution/firmware with kernel 2.6?


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2007 9:40 am 
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robod wrote:
Andre, I've just tried your latest v87 kernel, with the same result :cry:.
Have you got any early & relatively stable 2.6.XX kernel somewhere? I need it to be stable enough to reboot, and do my USB killer test...


robod, sorry, I was completely under water at work these weeks...

Two weeks ago I built a kernel from Sylvers SVN tree. I made a new configuration from scratch removing all not needed features, taking out all debug options using only modules I really need and got a kernel which runs since that without a crash. One TS is running now for eight days with a root fs on USB.

Last night I took that configuration and added three modules: ftdi_sio.ko, pl2303.ko, usbserial.ko. Made a clean build. Bootet the new kernel from hard disk. And immediatly the crashes/freezes are back. 4 crashes in half an hour during apt-get + dpkg runs. Corrupted /var/lib/dpkg/available. And worse: Even without accessing any USB device!

So far I can see there is no USB patch in any of Sylvers/andres 2.6 kernels. The NEC chip in TS PPC is widely used in the Intel PC world. So it is unlikely that the problem is in the USB subsystem. I think it is an I/O problem, somehow timing and load related and so more often seen on USB. DMA, Memory Mapping, Interrupt handling...

I had not time enough to analyze what all the changes from Buffalo and Monta Vista in the 2.4 source under arch/ppc are for. Much of the changes are loader specific. Maybe Sylver could provide some hints what he took over in the universal kernel and where maybe are some areas where we could have a look?


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2007 10:13 am 
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Were these three modules you are talking about loaded or not? Do you think it's usbserial, [EOU]HCI?


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2007 11:02 am 
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andre wrote:
To repeat my answer to your repeated question, kernel_universal is the kernel deployed, unless otherwise mentioned. FYI, the AVR problems have been addressed successfully in the meantime, v87 will be the next variant-legacy.
Sorry Andre, I get it now.
I wasn't clear from your first post. "universal kernel is all you need" isn't necessary the same as "I don't add anything else before I compile it" ;-). It is crystal clear to you guys who are deeply involved, but it wasn't to me. I found several different how-tos in Wiki and the forums and Internet, so I couldn't figure out what exactly are you doing to get the kernel compiled. But, I am happy with the answer now :-) ...


andre wrote:
Have you ever tried a different distribution/firmware with kernel 2.6?
Not yet. I was thinking about it, but I am not sure whether it will make much sense as it's clearly the kernel that is causing trouble. Before I destroy my installation :-( and replace it with a different distribution, I will have a look at what IGS found out and may be you will be able to check it as well.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2007 3:32 pm 
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robod wrote:
andre wrote:
kernel_universal is the kernel deployed, unless otherwise mentioned. FYI, the AVR problems have been addressed successfully in the meantime, v87 will be the next variant-legacy.

[...] "universal kernel is all you need" isn't necessary the same as "I don't add anything else before I compile it"


These were the major stages of kernel and bootloader development, as far as my package is concerned: The first series (<v30) was compiled with the genbako and melfs (anti-ext? byteswap) patches, and came with a simple insmod loader "sylver style", which I improved somewhat, and by daemons and configuration tweaks for OpenLink, Debian, Gentoo I added. The next phase was characterized by the appearance of the current kernel loader, based on lyakh's concept, whose major advantages are the fact the kernel is loaded from a read-only file system, and that it can disable itself if something goes wrong. With kernel 2.6.19, the melfs patch ceased working, lb_worm adapted it. Around v63, the box-specific kernels (-hg and -ls) were replaced by genbako's plus sylver's universal PPC patch, which also works on the Terastation with minor modifications (-ppc). The current state of development is sylver's kernel_universal (-uni), which can be SVN'd with all the patches included.

For the sake of comleteness, I apply the upstream patches to update e.g. from 2.6.23 to 2.6.23.1 on top of that.

andre wrote:
Have you ever tried a different distribution/firmware with kernel 2.6?
Not yet. I was thinking about it, but I am not sure whether it will make much sense as it's clearly the kernel that is causing trouble.[/quote]

That's where I'm not so sure.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 3:29 pm 
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Could you test the kernel in my tmp directory for me? Install it "over" a complete v88 please.


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 30, 2007 1:09 am 
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Apologies everyone who's trying to help for being incommunicado for more than a month. I hit loads of problems with my LS1 and then Xmas hit me :D. Now that the Xmas madness is over, I've got more time to play with it.

I've come to a conclusion that most (or all?) of my problems are probably caused by a faulty power supply. I've opened a new topic under hardware section (to stay on-topic ;)) here: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=4747

My LS is totally unusable, so I have to solve that first before returning to this problem.


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